위해/위해서?

[Gudrun]

Please, can somebody tell me what the normal conversational equivalent to 위해/위해서is and how it's used--how it connects to verbs, nouns, etc. (I have the definition of 위해/위해서as in order to or for the sake of.) I hear this expression in songs, but my textbook says it doesn't sound natural in spoken Korean, only in writing. So, what do Koreans use to mean the same thing when speaking?

Thanks for any help!

[timandyou]

Thanks for the comment.
Since you know some of Korean, I will try to explain this with some Korean.
Your question is about the usage of 위해/위해서.

How to use it is various.

1. Object (Noun) + 위해/위해서
Examples: Noun + Object particles (을/를) + 위해/위해서 = "for the sake of Noun"
너를 위해/너를 위해서 "for you = for the sake of you"
회사를 위해/회사를 위해서 "for the company = for the sake of company"
부모님을 위해/부모님을 위해서 "for the parents = for the sake of parents"
친구를 위해/친구를 위해서 "for the friends = for the sake of friends"
It's simple and easy, right?

2. -기 (Verb) + 위해/위해서 = (it's somewhat similar to the usage of "in order to"??)
Examples: Verb-stem + 기 + 위해/위해서 = "in order to verb"
살기 위해/살기 위해서 "in order to live or in order to survive" (살다 "to live" - 살 is VERB-STEM)
먹기 위해/먹기 위해서 "in order to eat" (먹다 "to eat" - 먹 is VERB-STEM)
놀기 위해/놀기 위해서 "in order to play" (놀다 "to play" - 놀 is VERB-STEM)
회사를 가기 위해/회사를 가기 위해서 "in order to go to the company" (가다 "to go" - 가 is VERB-STEM)
Isn't it simple too!? It's all the matter of whether you clearly know the VERB-STEM for each verb.
If you know the form of VERB-STEM, this usage is a piece of cake!

I think that's all for now.
There might be more than 1 & 2 above. But those 1 & 2 are the most frequently used.
I hope my explanation helps you understand Korean better.
Thank you, Gudrun~~~
cheers,

Tim

[Gudrun]

Wow, Tim, you are sooo fast. Thank you!

But could you tell me another way to say 위해/위해서 that sounds more natural in spoken (casual) Korean. One of my classmates suggested
도록 but I'm not sure if the meaning is really equivalent or how it's used: what does it connect to and how? (Gee, I'm sorry to always be asking so many questions. The more I study Korean, the more I realize I don't know.)
Thanks!

[timandyou]

I will make it quick and simple!
You mentioned about 도록.
The grammar rule is -하도록.

Okay between 위해 vs 도록.
The English translation for each a bit differs.

1. -(하기) 위해 = in order to, for the sake of...
2. -(하)도록 = so that... so as to,

I mentioned and explained about 1 already.
Okay, here is about -(하)도록.

Examples: Verb-Stem + 도록
1. 아침 일곱 시에 밥을 먹도록 (먹다 "to eat" - 먹 is verb-stem) 준비해 주세요.
"Please prepare my meal so that I can have it at 7:00"
If I change this sentence by using 위해 instead of 도록, for example 먹기위해, sounds not quite right!
아침 일곱 시에 밥을 먹기위해 준비해 주세요...??

2. 넌 이것을 하도록 해!
"You should do it so as I (said/mentioned)"
If I use 위해 instead of 도록, for example 하기위해, the sentence is wrong!
넌 이것을 하기위해 해!... NO!

3. 이 버스를 타도록 빨리 일어나야 해!
"(We) should get up early so as to take this bus!"
If I use 위해 instead of 도록, for example 타기위해, the sentence is totally okay!
이 버스를 타기위해 빨리 일어나야 해! .. OKAY!

See, how complicated it becomes!
This is enough for now. I can explain more with details but that's too much for me and for you.
cheers,

Tim

[julialim]

Wow! Yes Tim is so fast. lol:wink:

Hello Gudrun 님

"도록" means like "in order to, so that, in such a way that". But meaning is different with 위해(for)
It expresses a purpose or aim. (reason? a little)
verb stem + 도록
--> 가다 = 가(verb stem) + 도록 ---> 가도록
--> 하다 = 하(verb stem) + 도록 ---> 하도록
잊지 않도록 메모하세요.
please take a note so that you won't forget it.

But... 도록 is more common to express arranging or influencing something to achieve a desire result.

"(verb stem) + 도록 하다." : make it so that

건강을 위해서 담배를 끊도록 하세요.
Please stop smoking for your health.
살을 빼기 위해 운동을 하도록 하세요.
Work out so that you can lose your weight.

A little information for you. lol

[manyakumi]

Hello Gudrun.
I'm sean (also known as Dr.Sean )
and I'm going to answer for the rest of your question.

1. Object (Noun) + 위해/위해서
Examples: Noun + Object particles (을/를) + 위해/위해서 = "for the sake of Noun"
너를 위해/너를 위해서 "for you = for the sake of you"
회사를 위해/회사를 위해서 "for the company = for the sake of company"
부모님을 위해/부모님을 위해서 "for the parents = for the sake of parents"
친구를 위해/친구를 위해서 "for the friends = for the sake of friends"
It's simple and easy, right?

2. -기 (Verb) + 위해/위해서 = (it's somewhat similar to the usage of "in order to"??)
Examples: Verb-stem + 기 + 위해/위해서 = "in order to verb"
살기 위해/살기 위해서 "in order to live or in order to survive" (살다 "to live" - 살 is VERB-STEM)
먹기 위해/먹기 위해서 "in order to eat" (먹다 "to eat" - 먹 is VERB-STEM)
놀기 위해/놀기 위해서 "in order to play" (놀다 "to play" - 놀 is VERB-STEM)
회사를 가기 위해/회사를 가기 위해서 "in order to go to the company" (가다 "to go" - 가 is VERB-STEM)

#1 is being used often in spoken language.

#2 sounds kinda written.
So, we use '~려고' more often instead.

살기 위해/살기 위해서 -> 살려고
먹기 위해/먹기 위해서 -> 먹으려고
놀기 위해/놀기 위해서 -> 놀려고
회사를 가기 위해 -> 회사를 가려고


Hope this help!

[timandyou]

안녕하세요 Sean님,
감사, 감사~~
best,

Tim