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Oft used expressions

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Oft used expressions

Postby orbiter » September 9th, 2012 10:55 am

Hello everyone! A few questions on grammar structures I often hear...

1) "...거고"
- "...있는 거고"; "...되는 거고"; "할거고"; "볼거고" etc. Is this from "것이다/거다"? (By the way, is 것이다 and 거다 the same? They both imply the future right?)

2) "[thought/speech] 하다"
- "경찰에 신고할까 하다가, 무슨 일인지도 모르고해서..." (this pattern is used twice here, first with 하다 then with 해서... right?)
- "이건 아니다해서 글올립니다"
Is this the same as "[speech] 싶다" e.g. ""경찰에 신고할까 싶다"; "그 사람은 부자일까 싶다"; "친구한테 연락 하는게 낫지 않을까 싶은데..."

3) "~다 마나"
- "왜 밥이 먹다 마나?" (Why did you eat and then stop eating? Something like that)
- "말을 왜 하다 마나?"
I guess this is used in a similar way as "할까 말까". Is this usage formal/informal?


Thank you in advance!
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Postby trutherous » September 9th, 2012 2:11 pm

Hi again Orbiter! You are such a great student of Korean! I should be doing my homework but I'm burned out at the moment --your questions are providing me a little much-needed distraction.
1)"...거고"
- "...있는 거고"; "...되는 거고"; "할거고"; "볼거고" etc. Is this from "것이다/거다"? (By the way, is 것이다 and 거다 the same? They both imply the future right?)


This looks to me like a contraction of ~것이다. 그리고... the idea that something (거) IS (있는), turns out as (되는), will be performed (할), will be tried (볼) .. and that the information is not complete (고) 'and something' could be added/ additional explanation or information --but some people just end there with "고" as a kind of speech habit.

And as far as I know 것이다 and 거다 have the same meaning, also, I think the pattern is only be future tense when preceded by ~ㄹ 있을 거다, 될 거다, 할 거다, 해 볼 거다 etc.


2) "[thought/speech] 하다"
- "경찰에 신고할까 하다가, 무슨 일인지도 모르고해서..." (this pattern is used twice here, first with 하다 then with 해서... right?)
- "이건 아니다해서 글올립니다"
Is this the same as "[speech] 싶다" e.g. ""경찰에 신고할까 싶다"; "그 사람은 부자일까 싶다"; "친구한테 연락 하는게 낫지 않을까 싶은데..."


Those look great to me. Yeah I they are nearly identical in meaning "thinking about but hesitating" Orbiter I think you understand these better than I do, I'm always getting this form of ~~싶다 mixed up with ~~고 싶어요.

3) "~다 마나"
- "왜 밥이 먹다 마나?" (Why did you eat and then stop eating? Something like that)
- "말을 왜 하다 마나?"
I guess this is used in a similar way as "할까 말까". Is this usage formal/informal?


The pattern you are looking for is probably ~나 마나 and expresses "there's no point in"

하나 마나 - "there's no point in doing something"
먹으나 마나 - "there's no point in eating it" usually meaning "It's too tiny a portion"
그 약은 먹으나 마나였다. There was no point in taking the medicine (it didn't help at all).

- "왜 밥이 먹다 말다 하니?" Why did you eat and then stop?
- "말을 왜 하다 말다 하니?" Why did you talk and then stop talking?

I think 할까말까 is only used in the first person -- like "I'm wondering if I should or shouldn't."
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Postby team.relationships » September 9th, 2012 8:53 pm

영훈님!

"할까말까"
아직 어떤 일에 대한 선택을 하지 못했을 경우에 주로 사용하지요~

A; " 오늘 오후에 머할까?"
B; "글쎄, 외출을 할까 말까? 아직 잘 모르겠네"

친절한 설명 고맙습니다!

Anne,
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Postby trutherous » September 10th, 2012 4:14 pm

"할까말까"
아직 어떤 일에 대한 선택을 하지 못했을 경우에 주로 사용하지요~

A; " 오늘 오후에 머할까?"
B; "글쎄, 외출을 할까 말까? 아직 잘 모르겠네"


"글쎄, 외출을 할까 말까? 아직 잘 모르겠네" -Well, I'm still undecided about whether I should or shouldn't dine out? -or- Well, I just can't decide whether I should go out or not.

갈까말까? - Should I go or not? (asking myself)
그 일을 할까말까 했어요 - I was undecided about doing that work.
그 일을 할까말까 생각 중이에요 - I was thinking about whether I should do that work or not.

네. 무슨 말인지 알아요. 단지 본인이 대해서만 사용하는 표현인지 아니면 남에 대해서도 사용할 수 있는지 잠깐 헷갈렸어요. 그래서 내가 "in the first person"이라고 한 거예요. 생각해 보니까 남에 대해서도 쓸 수 있는 표현이네요. 하지만 생각과 느낌을 표시하는 말이니까 남의 일에 대해서 이 표현을 그대로 쓰면 종종 어색할까 봐요.

조금만 어색하지 않나요? :arrow: "스티부는 갈까말까 생각 중이에요"

It seems awkward to me because I don't really know what Steve is in the middle of thinking, so I can't speak for him; however, if we make it a quotation with ~이래요 or with add conjecture with "~가/나 보다" (looks like, seems like, appears to me) it makes more sense to me:

스티부는 갈까말까 생각 중이래요 -Steve says he's in the middle of deciding whether to go or not.
스티부는 갈까말까 생각 중인가 봐요 - It appears to me that Steve is in the middle of deciding whether to go or not.
Last edited by trutherous on September 13th, 2012 4:53 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby kc101com » September 11th, 2012 10:58 am

trutherous wrote:
네. 무슨 말인지 알아요. 단지 본인이 대해서만 사용하는 표현인지 아니면 남에 대해서도 사용할 수 있는지 잠깐 헷갈렸어요. 그래서 내가 "in the first person"이라고 한 거예요. 생각해 보니까 남에 대해서도 쓸 수 있는 표현이네요. 하지만 생각과 느낌을 표시하는 말이니까 남의 일에 대해서 이 표현을 그대로 쓰면 종종 어색할까 봐요.

조금만 어색하지 않나요? :arrow: "스티부는 갈까말까 생각 중이에요"

It seems awkward to me because I don't really know what Steve is in the middle of thinking, so I can't speak for him; however, if we make it a quotation with ~이래요 or with add conjecture with "~나 보다" (looks like, seems like, appears to me) it makes more sense to me:

스티부는 갈까말까 생각 중이래요 -Steve says he's in the middle of deciding whether to go or not.
스티부는 갈까말까 생각 중이나 봐요 - It appears to me that Steve is in the middle of deciding whether to go or not.



Hi orbiter and trutherous!



I am impressed by trutherous again as always!

Great explanation regarding the undecided phrases!

As you have well-mentioned, it is hard to tell somebody's thinking unless it's yours.

So the case you could use this word to someone else is when you talked with that person about it.

Or you if you had caught something from him.

For example, if you had talked with Steve and he had asked you if you were going to go to that party or not, then you might be able to say so especially if you had also asked him as well on his rsvp!

Then you could say, 스티브는 갈까 말까 생각중인 것 같아요, or 갈까말까 생각 중인가 봐요!

In usual you could say to yourself that 난 그 파티 갈까 말까 고민중이에요 :)

Hope this helped and thank you for your question and answer!

Ask us anytime whenever you have question! :)



Thank you

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Postby orbiter » September 12th, 2012 8:51 pm

자세한 설명해주셔서 감사합니다!!!
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